FitPro Foundations Podcast – Hosted by Karyn Silenzi Life Fitness/ICG Development Manager Mike Michels

Transcript (English)

Karyn 0:07

Welcome to FitPro Foundations, the podcast where you’ll hear fitness professionals provide the ideas and inspirations behind their success. My name is Karen Silenzi, and today I have the pleasure of speaking with Mike Miches,l Development Manager for the indoor cycling division of Life Fitness, ICG. Mike oversees North and South America and is utilized as a sales specialist for Life Fitness indoor cycling products and programs. Mike has been described as “the most experienced active indoor cycling instructor on the planet”. This is an episode that you’re not going to want to miss. Welcome, Mike. 

Mike 0:57

Thank you very much for having me. Appreciate it.

Karyn 0:58

I’m absolutely thrilled to have you here today because I’ve got some very deep questions. But before we dive into that, could you provide a broad overview of what it is exactly that you do now.

Mike 1:16

Sure. So I am the, like I said, Development Manager for Life Fitness. And what that kind of means is Life Fitness purchased the company ICG, indoor cycling group, about five years ago. So we now sit under that umbrella of the Life Fitness family of brands as the indoor cycling offering and segment of their business. So as the development manager I basically oversee everything that we do from the indoor cycling category, and then kind of work in conjunction with Life Fitness. As far as facilitating what we do there with the sales of the product and working with their admin and whatever. So, essentially you just say, I oversee the indoor cycling division for ICG within the Life Fitness category.

Karyn 2:06

Now, we have talked a little bit earlier, before we started recording here about how the current pandemic or situation regarding COVID has shifted your role, just slightly. There’s a lot of fitness professionals that are currently in similar situations. So, how have things changed over the past year, year and a half, when it comes to your role?

Mike 2:33

Yeah, good question. Like everybody definitely there’s been an effect. So I spend a lot of my time out in the field working with sales reps, working with customers, being on-site at locations and kind of checking out and seeing what’s going on with, the product, the equipment, and just you know how everything’s going and then making sure they’re aware of what we have and what we can do and what we can offer so some good face to face traveling around, also being at trade shows and conferences and things of that nature so yep a little bit of time at home, you know, home office work. But then a very good amount of time outside in the field. For the last year and a half now, I have not done one work-related travel, you know, type of work since February of 2020, so to be grounded and to be behind a desk, at the home office, day in and day out, it’s getting a little, a little tiresome, it has had an effect, you could say, so I’m just dying, dying to get back out and just to be able to interact and be face to face with people. 

Karyn 3:45

And I think that that sentiment is echoed by every single fitness professional across North America definitely. Now February 2020, you and I were live, in person. Was that your last

Mike 3:58

interaction. That was my last interaction. My last work-related travel type of situation was the end of February in Calgary, Alberta, you know, working with a key group up there on some indoor cycling information, yeah. 

Karyn 4:26

Oh man, that’s it, that’s a lot of pressure on my end, I hope that I made it a memorable event for you, Mike! Obviously what we’re trying to do here is give insight to other fitness professionals, and really light the fire of inspiration in them in understanding that, you know, whether you’re a personal trainer, whether you’re managing in the fitness industry, whether you’re in sales equipment, or whether you’re a fitness instructor – there are a lot of different routes that people can take, that don’t necessarily fit the common mold that people would expect. Now, I love the fact that I get to talk to you today because you helped launch the spinning program 25 years ago. You’re also a former USA Triathlon coach and certified personal trainer, through NASM, and you have also worked with Chris Carmichael, which is Lance Armstrong’s ex/old coach. Tell us a little bit more about your overall involvement in the history behind shaping the indoor cycling industry.

Mike 5:39

Well, you’re right, over 25 years ago, so when you talked about the 25 years worth of content I could probably talk about right now, so I’ll try to condense it and keep it as short as possible but yeah you know what I mean, come on up, from, starting out in your 20s, and just having a let’s call it a passion for the sport of swimming, riding and running, is that I just I’ve always gravitated towards things I’ve always been doing those things to be able to put that into practice and to be coming right out of college, and, and then kind of taking that love and the passion for training in those, three modalities and then racing and so forth. I actually had a corporate job, you know, at the same time when it came out of college while I was doing the triathlons stuff on the side, and after about four or five years. I was like I don’t want to do corporate anymore I don’t want to do just a traditional kind of like marketing sales job that I was in at the time, and I said I wanted to start pursuing something that has to do with the sport that I was doing. 

So I looked into the health and fitness industry and becoming a personal trainer and got my certification and started personal training and getting into the gym and so forth. And then as I would, as I started to learn more and more about just what was out there. I found out and had heard about what Johnny G, and Mad Dogg athletics in the sprint program was getting ready to launch and put out there to the industry. So  I contacted them started talking to them and told them who I was and what I’ve been doing that I have a passion for cycling and so forth. And the more I found out about what they were doing and so forth getting involved, you know, got on board with them. And then, yep 1995 Johnny Mad Dogg, you know that the launch had happened at IHRSA, in which they made it known, that there is this other kind of opportunity to experience if you want to see what can be offered within fitness facilities and so forth as group indoor cycling type of an offering. And it just snowballed from there. I mean it took off, like, just, I hate to use the word gangbusters but it did. It took off like gangbusters. And I spent a better part of like the next five years from ‘95 to 2000, like traveling almost three weekends out of a month, like nonstop for almost five years just going out and working with clubs, instructors, getting them trained and in the industry program, then started traveling around the world because we weren’t really established just yet then with distributors, dealers, and master trainers in all areas of around the world. S I got to do that  – you can work with clubs and customers, you’d be at different conferences and trade shows around the world. And that was life, working as a personal trainer traveling around promoting and spinning programs and training facilities and instructors on implementing it in the facilities.

And, you know, It all just kind of kept morphing. From there, to then moving into that ability to do the internships that I did the US Olympic Training Center in Colorado Springs, to become a USA tri coach. At the same time, we’d been talking to Chris Carmichael because he was getting ready to launch his triathlon Gold program, which is like an online platform kind of like Training Peaks now, but he was one of the first innovators on doing like an online type of platform for being able to coach endurance athletes. So I was one of his triathlon coaches, I implemented his principles of training, you know, to both amateurs as well as pros that were, you know out there racing and wanting to be able to have some of these coaching methodologies and principles implemented. 

So, you know, I was kind of doing both. I loved it both from an outdoor standpoint and trying to grow and become better and, you know, have a better understanding from a coaching standpoint and working with it, hands on out there in the outdoor world but then also being able to bring some of that experience or that understanding or knowledge into the indoor side of it. Loving what you can get from the indoor cycling side of it because outdoor is a little bit sterile, you know it’s just like performance. It’s about the racing and what you can do to get better and working with athletes in a way that is more like the black and white of it all, you can say, like just very standard. But when you get to the indoor side of it, it was about the energy and the interaction, you know, With 20 people in a class or 50 people in a class or 500 people at Spinning live ride events that would be down in a parking lot somewhere under a tent. 

So, from the indoor cycling, that drew me in, so, much there was just that interaction, and that energy, and that passion that kind of came along for, you know, how indoor cycling started to take off and this phenomenon that it became, kind of bled into actually working at Mad Dogg Athletics in California, in Vegas, at the offices, not only still as like a master trainer for them but then it became the head of training and facility kind of support. Say “hey, now that you’re getting, your indoor cycling program in your facility, here’s ways that you can, make it special, make it unique, make it profitable, make it you know basically just a way to keep member retention and things of that nature. So it kind of went beyond just being a master instructor for them. But then also, again, like, head of training, working with facilities, and making sure that  witas just, you know, continuing to grow from there. 

So, from 1995 until 2005 that’s kind of where I was and what I was doing for not only Spinning but what started to become just kind of an effect on the cycling industry in general, to then also trying to cross that line between the outdoor world and having the benefits I guess if you want to say in getting the experiences from both sides, both in and out, indoor, outdoor, and, and yeah I don’t know. I mean it’s just continued from there. About 2005 I left from working with Spinning and with Mad Dogg, there were other projects that I was involved in. 

In 2012, ICG, Indoor Cycling Group based out of Germany, approached me and said “hey listen, here’s something that we’re gonna be doing with our products as we move forward, we’d love to get your input”, and all that kind of stuff. Once I saw that they were doing with a Coach by Color program, and being the first company to put a power meter on an indoor cycling bike, I was like, yep, sign me up, and so ever since 2012 I’ve been working with them and what they got for like nine years now. Oh my gosh. I am old. Then everything that we’ve now done with that I feel like it’s almost been the next evolution and the next era and the next change of we where we sit now, within the indoor cycling industry, compared to what it was back in the 90s. So, there’s my 25 year, you know, long-winded version of how I started.

Karyn 13:40

I think it’s amazing, I literally have goosebumps here. And, you know there’s a lot to unpack, in what you said here, obviously, so I was writing down a couple of things that I wanted to drill into just a little bit deeper. First and foremost, you make it sound really easy, Because it sounds like opportunities presented themselves every step of the way, and I know that you work hard and so that it’s not just a matter of being in the right place at the right time. What were some of the things that you did to make yourself seen as an industry leader, so that when these opportunities, became available, the industry sought Mike Michels out?

Mike 14:36

It was probably like I said at the beginning because I just had a passion for what I was doing, the training side of things, that endurance athlete kind of side of things, not that I was some pro, you know. I wasn’t even some high-end elite guy, I just loved doing it. And sure I had some small successes from an amateur standpoint and whatever, but I just loved getting out, getting into a pool, or getting into a lake or an ocean and doing swims. I loved being on the bike, whether it was mountain biking or road riding and just doing it and then running, I love running so to take all three of those and then to be traveling around and racing, that’s what I love to do and that’s all I wanted to do. It made me want to pursue more, it made me want to know more, it made me want to follow some of the people who were the leaders at the time, whether it was from a coaching standpoint or whether it was from an athlete standpoint, which is then taking that passion for the things that had happened outside. 

Once I started getting inside, whether it was as a personal trainer, or then what became the indoor cycling side of it, because of the passion I wanted to keep finding out more and I wanted to keep pursuing people on the indoor side of things now more, I wanted to find out more of what I could do, or what the opportunities were around it. So with that, it means that you’re starting to talk to more people or new people or you’re starting to, read and see what other kinds of opportunities existed or what projects were starting to be worked on. 

Like, say Chris Carmichael, it’s like just a conversation and through reading and being aware of what was happening out there. I heard that he was going to want to launch a platform, he hadn’t launched yet I was like, “Hey, Chris, you don’t know me, but here’s who I am and here’s what I have done and and and whenever I’d love to be part of it”. And then through the conversations it morphed into being able to work with them. 

The same thing with USA Triathlon. I heard that the USA Triathlon was going to start an internship program to train people on what would be needed to be a USA tri coach. So I heard about it before it had happened, but because it was something that I had a passion for and I want to know more about it and I started to call and ask. Since you say it was almost like a little bit of initiative on my part, that as I hear things that, would start to come about. And if it resonated with me, then I was like okay, well then, let me start talking to them, let me find out. It was the same thing with Johnny, they were Spinning. I heard that there was going to be some sort of stationary bike class thing going on where you just sit there and you kind of train and race, or you kind of like train you do stuff on a bike, both in the saddle and out of the saddle and hand positions and riding positions and it’s all stationary, and it’s to music, as like, “What’s going on?” so I wanted to find out more about it.

So, you know, it just, it just depends. It depends on the person. I mean if you’ve got a passion for something and you’re willing to at least make the initial attempt, four steps to find out more or to talk more about it or to, you know, pursue it in whatever way possible, then, then it’s almost like doors open. And it just so happened that a lot of different doors were opening through the mid 90s late 90s, early 2000s in these kinds of areas where again, things that were indoor cycling related as well as some things that were happening outdoor, to call it triathlon related in coaching, and so forth. So yes there was a little bit of kind of like the ‘right time, right place’, but I still had to take the initiative to follow the things that I was passionate about that I wanted to do, to just being involved with more, and then again just were more doors just kept holding along the way so I got I still have to feel that I’m kind of blessed and fortunate to have had called the path that I’ve had, and I wouldn’t have changed that, in any other way.

Karyn 19:07

And I can tell because the passion is just exuding from you when you talk about this. And I absolutely agree. We don’t know what we don’t know, right? There are 100 opportunities available to us at this very moment, but we won’t know of those opportunities unless we seek them out. What we don’t know. And I think that you’ve just provided an excellent illustration of that point, and yes, there is the matter of being in the right place at the right time. But you made yourself available, you kept your ear to the ground, you were listening for opportunities, you were networking within the areas that brought you passion, and as a result, when those opportunities came available, you – I mean forgive me for saying this but, you weren’t scared to step outside of your comfort zone and asked to do something that perhaps a more well-known person wouldn’t have known necessarily who you were. But they took you on under the faith of how passionate you were about all of this – is that a fair thing to say?

Mike 20:30

Yeah. You hit the nail on the head there. I think it was, it was a scenario in which I think people were developing or creating something. They knew that they would probably need some help along the way. And because I started knocking on the doors, and I don’t think that was a little pushy at all or maybe I was, you know, they could see that this is something that I really cared about and I want to do and that I had some ability. I had some knowledge and I had some background, whatever that is, you know, soI was paying they’re paying a bite I should probably say Right. Because of that, they saw that this guy seems like he really wants to do this and be a part of this – so that gave me a chance. 

Karyn 21:26

I love it. You know, this evolution that you talked about. We saw indoor cycling hit the stage, in a very large way, that essentially changed our industry forever. And the fitness industry is always changing, albeit at a very slow pace. But once Johnny G came on the scene, and this phenomenon started, we’ve seen an evolution over the years. We have seen people focused on power training, people focused on more competitive collaboration within the cycle room itself. And then we’ve also seen the phenomenon of rhythm riding and “dancing on the bike”. So, without putting you in a position where you’re uncomfortable about speaking about it, what is your attitude towards all the different ways that fitness instructors or fitness professionals can use the bikes for training – because we’ve got power, we’ve got training, and then we’ve got dancing. Are you comfortable with people using the bike to offer all of those, or any of those, or a combination of those?

Mike 22:50

Of course, because at the end of the day it all supports, what is called the industry of cycling, because what if, when you’re talking about the masses and you’re talking about the different types of capabilities and what can happen, and the fact that there are people in the world that just want to have fun, and just want to have an experience, and just want to not necessarily pay attention to data or information – but they just want to come in and have a great ride and leave and sweat on the floor. Walk out just feeling like they did something for themselves that day. And, half of the entire population wants to do that. And then the other half of the population, you know, does want something that’s trackable, tangible, information, “so how many calories did I burn today? How far did I ride? What was my average this or that. Am I better now than I was six months ago?” , and what are the kinds of the metrics or the tracking points that will let me know that. I mean come on – wearable devices, tracking devices, are one of the most popular things right now. Hence, Apple products, Strava Garmin, you name it, I mean everything is what’s going on what’s trackable now, and information and data that goes along with it. 

So, the fact that we’ve got some of the indoor cycling population out there who is, you could say doing the rhythm rides and dance on the bike. Awesome, great, keep doing it. And then you got the other half that you could say is maybe a little bit more performance-related oriented and looking for traditional kind of riding is awesome and great. Let’s let that half of the population, continue to do that as well, but there is also a blend. I hate to say it but look at what Peloton does. I mean it’s dancing on a bike, so I’ll leave that out there. Dancing on the bike in some regards, but there’s still information, on their platform, there’s still some data, there’s a leaderboard  if you want to say, So they’ve done a great job of blending the two. 

Flywheel, unfortunately, not really around anymore but,, Flywheel was great at the same thing, where it was kind of like dancing on the bike and it was choreographed, but, again, a couple of times through the ride, they’d throw up on the board, your data and information that was there, on the bike, so you could follow. 

So, I think, to answer your questions, the big long-winded answer is that all of it, and how it’s being done around the world is great because it only strengthens what this indoor cycling industry is and it’s going to continue to give it life for years to come, which means that we have jobs for years to come.

Karyn 26:15

I think that’s a really healthy attitude. I think that when we stick to those binary choices of “yes or no, right or wrong, black or white”, we have this scarcity mindset. “If it can’t be my way, then there’s no other way out there.” 

And let’s face it, we have a lot of different options and opportunities. And the more open we are to who it is that we service, who our customer is, and what our customers want – there’s room, there’s room to shape ourselves. Because, I know for a fact that the way that I started teaching cycling is completely different from everything that I do now, from how I plan my classes, to what expectations I have of myself, to what I want my riders to experience at the end of the day. And right now I teach pure power classes, and I also teach rhythm classes. And, I will have people in my rhythm classes that want power, and I will have people in my power classes that want rhythm, so there is room for us all.

You bring up a really good point about Peloton. They know their clients.  I heard a great saying “ you have to stand for something, or else you fall for everything”. So yes, we can walk in there knowing what it is that we want to achieve, yet being accepting – we can be accepting of what other people need or want. And knowing that we can’t please everyone. 

I find it absolutely fascinating that you come from a racing background – I mean, you’ve competed on a national level for over 20 years in triathlons and mountain bike adventure races. And you also have a host of infomercials, and lead instructor in over 40 different training cycling videos. So you’ve got this background, where you are coaching to power, where you’re speaking about metrics, where you’re putting yourself out there with a very specific way of how you’re bringing your trade to the public. And yet, earlier, when we’re talking about the large ICG events- I don’t know if you actually said it was a large ICG event – but when I hear about ICG events, and they have 500 bikes, 700 bikes, 1000 bikes, all filled with people. And there’s a large stage presence and you’ve got smoke works going off, you’ve got live drummers and dancers on stage and teaching to this amazing mass of people, it’s not all just about the metrics or the power – it’s about the experience. I’d love to drill into what it feels like to be involved in some of these globally anticipated events such as the ICG ride event. What can you tell us about that?

Mike 29:45

We did some large event rides which have been going on ever since the beginning. And, I’ll definitely talk about the ICG side of it but I mean, back in the day, we started doing this back in the 90s, I mean we were showing up in parking lots of large locations with tents and having 200 bikes under the tent, to where then it grew to maybe 300- 400 bikes, under the tent. And yeah, a couple of instructors up on the stage, and it was just music, and it was just “let’s go for the next four hours, six hours, eight hours”. 

It was just coming together as a community of people who loved this thing of indoor cycling, and just sharing time together, sharing experiences together. And you know it just never stopped. I mean, once we did this thing, and it was kind of like, put a stamp out there that “Hey, it’s okay to do something like this”, everybody did it. All the different brands would have large live ride events and for hours at a time or for fundraising purposes, even for charities. It started back in the 90s and it never stopped. Suddenly, everybody’s doing it in some way, fashion, or form. 

So yes, I mean ICG, who has been around also since 1995 and had started their live rides, from years ago. It has morphed. The next time that we have one, which is going to be in 2022, I think we’re slated right now to have an 800 bike event in a hockey stadium or hockey arena, where they also have concerts, because we need enough space to be able to you know have the all the bikes you know in there along with the type of platform stage that we have that’s revolving. And then all of the all the different kinds of live music, or people on stage with us to provide this, you could almost say again, half rhythm ride, just good old fun kind of thing going on to put to the same point that, as the people on stage are riding in green, then everybody in the stadium knows, I’m going to make sure I’m in green. To just see the whole stadium lit up in color like that – where all 800 bikes are in green, are listening to this live drummer on stage, both in and out of the saddle for 30 minutes straight and, I mean, come on, it’s just one of those kinds of moments where you just – I don’t want to say like you just feel like you’re lost somewhere, but you are just caught in that moment, you know, and it’s just it’s hard to describe unless you’ve experienced, stuff like that before.

Karyn 33:00

I think there are some videos on YouTube about it and even watching the videos, you just break out in goosebumps because you can just feel the passion and – I know you’ve said that it feels like you’re getting lost in the moment, and I always got the sense that it felt like everyone was coming together in the moment in complete synchronicity – and just that feeling of belonging, where you are with masses of people who all feel the exact same way. It’s really quite magical, would you say?

Mike 33:36

You’re right. No, you’re right, you’re that’s a great way to describe it, that you know how everybody’s coming together and it’s definitely in that moment. So yeah, you described it really well. Yes, yeah.

Karyn 33:50

Well, 2022 fingers crossed that the current situation is under control and everyone can come together once again. 

It’s interesting because I was asking a few of our common friends if they could come up with a single phrase to describe who Mike Michaels is and there was, oh, what is the name – Randy? How did that start? So there’s Mike on a bike. And then there’s, Randy, which I don’t know where that came from, but this is my favorites. And there’s a few more that, when we’re off the air I’ll feel free to share with you – but this one came across, which I absolutely loved. It is from a very well-known well-respected peer of yours who called you “the most experienced, active indoor cycling instructor on the planet”. And, clearly, someone that, while they don’t work with you any longer, they really do respect you. 

I mean, anytime the name ‘Mike Michels’ comes up there is a lot of respect. When you hear someone say something like that in reference to you, what does it mean to you? And don’t say it means that you’re old.

Mike 35:38

Feels good, feels good to hear. And what does it mean? It’s very subjective, obviously, you know, because there are a tremendous amount of just very impactful instructors, coaches and trainers, and so forth, that are out there. So subjective to maybe people that I’ve been able to come in contact with over the years. But, I don’t know, maybe it means that at the end of the day that I’ve done something right. And that’s all I can hope for. More that I’ve been able to, interact and have an effect, at some point along the way with the people that I’ve met and the things that we’ve done and so, you know yeah just, I guess it moves the needle.

Karyn 36:39

For many things, right? And also that your job is not done yet, because if you can have this type of an impact on people today and over the last 25 years, imagine what you can do over the next, I’m not gonna say 25 years because I don’t want you to break down in tears, but you know,

you take as long as you want to keep having that kind of an impact. I think that really speaks to the power and the leadership qualities that you display, not only to the people that you work directly with but to the people, as you say, that you’ve interacted with over the past. 

So yes, because that did come from a peer of yours and I think that speaks volumes. I want to dig into that just a little bit more because I know that your time is very precious. I don’t want to keep you for too long, but what do you look for when you’re bringing someone on to your team, or when you see someone in another country that you would feel would benefit the team that you’re working with, in that other country?

Mike 37:54

Passion, passion, you gotta want it. You gotta want it. So, whether it means to be a personal trainer whether it means to be an instructor whether it means to be a manager, you know within a facility when it means that you’re going to work more like on a product side of things or a program side of things or technology side of things is that you just have to have a passion for it, and you know like I said before with myself is like to the point that you, you want to bug people you’re bugging people to like give you a shot to give you a chance to say I, you know, I think, for nothing but I believe in the kind of the same things that you guys believe that. So I want to be a part of it. So, your passion. And you can teach them to teach in a way, so they’re already coming to the table saying that they want to do what you do or be a part of what you do. So, you can teach you to know some, some of the details side of the south side of it, but as long as there’s passion backing it up behind it all that. I know it’s probably a word we’ve thrown around 100 times already on this and sometimes it can be a little bit cliche but at the end of the day it’s a foundational type of thing that you want.

Karyn 39:16

And the desire to make an impact, not only for our own personal selves but both for what we believe in and the company that we’re working for. Right? Because some can be very passionate about elevating themselves while not putting the values or the needs of the company that you work for, ahead of what you want to accomplish for yourself. So I think that’s always really important to talk about because when I’m mentoring people, I always say you have to believe in yourself but you have to believe in the company that you represent, or that you’re working for, or that you want to work for because at the end of the day, you are that company and you want to make their jobs easier. You want to make them be more successful. So it’s always that service attitude. So I agree with you, I think, passion, very important, but I also think that it’s that service to the people that you work for and represent. That is absolutely key. 

Mike 40:20

You’re yeah you’re adding another perspective on it, which is great. 

Karyn 40:24

Yeah. We talked about all the things that you look for in people and what got to you to the point where you are at now. Do you have any other final piece of advice that you can provide to help those people that are looking to become more than they are today?

Mike 40:56

Well, you know the 1st thing is keeping being you, you know. Don’t try to be somebody else or be somebody that you are not, because if somebody said. “Hey do you wanna keep doing or get certified in yoga?”  I’d be like hell no, that’s not me, don’t put me in and because the passion wouldn’t probably come out the same way. Or the capabilities wouldn’t come out the same way. I know who I am and yoga instructor, I’m a baggin on the yoga instructors, it’s just that that kind of, let’s cal it segment of our business, is just not for me, so I’m not gonna fake it. I’m not going to try and go over and fake it just because Ineed to go get another class or teach another modality. So just know who you are, stay who you are, but then once you know it and you kind of know where your groove is and your specialty is, well then do everything you can to be the best you can be at it. Find your niche. Know who you are and find your niche and then what you are passionate about in that direction or that channel, then you have everything in your power to do it.

Karyn 41:01

Oh, I love it, and don’t be afraid to speak out, because I think that the current environment that we are in, we are so connected through social channels on the internet, and social media, and we literally can talk to anyone in the world, all it is is a matter of reaching out. So, people shouldn’t be afraid to take risks if they are pursuing the passion and it is authentic to them. Oh man, we are so fortunate right?

Mike 41:20

Yeah, yeah, I mean that’s a whole nother hour or podcast we could talk about what it means to find your niche and be you and then all the ways to pursue going about being the best you can be added I mean, there are so many other real tentacles to that but you know yeah it’s a whole lot of stuff.

Karyn 41:26

Well, I’ll book you in another time. Well, Mike on behalf of myself, KIPS Podcast, and the FitPro Foundations, I want to thank you so much for joining me today. I think that your story and how you have started, and shaped, and continue to support the industry – not only in indoor cycling but everything else you do and everyone else you have an impact on, thank you so much for joining me today.

Mike

Awe, thank you very much, I appreciate it.

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